Author Topic: Is the trigger/bolt spring really a problem?  (Read 101 times)

Offline ssb73q

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Is the trigger/bolt spring really a problem?
« on: June 13, 2018, 05:22:53 AM »
Hi, IMO a lot of monkey motions on preventing a trigger spring failure:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SXr_bN3fjrk

I have 49 BP revolvers that I use and have never had a trigger spring failure. I always turn the trigger spring screw down tight so the spring doesn't move in the frame recess. I also make sure that the trigger spring is centered in the frame opening so that no edge of the spring contacts the side of the frame. IMO keeping a trigger spring screw loose is a path for the spring to rub against the side of the frame opening.

I also don't like the wire trigger springs. They always need to be fitted while the flat springs always fit perfectly. IMO wire trigger springs are a solution for a problem that doesn't exist.

Even if one would occasionally break a trigger spring, what's the downside? A $6.50 new spring from VTI. If you are using a BP revolver for self defense and need modern gun reliability, then may God bless you.

Regards,
Richard
There’s nothing better in the morning than the smell of bacon and black powder smoke!

Offline Captainkirk

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Re: Is the trigger/bolt spring really a problem?
« Reply #1 on: June 13, 2018, 08:20:33 AM »
Generally, the cost of shipping is higher than the cost of the springs. If I need to order one, I usually get several and have some spares in my shooting box.
"You gonna pull those pistols, or whistle Dixie?"

Offline Yolla Bolly Brad

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Re: Is the trigger/bolt spring really a problem?
« Reply #2 on: June 13, 2018, 09:27:28 AM »
I guess I don't shoot enough to have ever broken a trigger/bolt spring. If it was an issue, I'd probably first try an aftermarket SA leaf spring or maybe even a genuine Colt part.

Offline Hawg

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Re: Is the trigger/bolt spring really a problem?
« Reply #3 on: June 13, 2018, 02:41:07 PM »
Been shooting them since 69 and never broke a trigger/bolt spring. If I do I have plenty of safety pins to make one out of.

Offline 45 Dragoon

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Re: Is the trigger/bolt spring really a problem?
« Reply #4 on: June 13, 2018, 07:53:08 PM »
Well, even though some folks never seem to have problems with springs, that doesn't mean it's not a common problem. I have broken quite a few in several different revolvers. I got a new (26 miles on the OD.)1976 Vega when I graduated H.S.  It turned out to be one of the most reliable cars I've ever owned to this day (probably shoulda kept it!)! Just goes to show ya .  . 
 
  Ok, I didn't hear any mention in the video about correct resistance (in lbs.) for the bolt spring. The trigger spring can also be adjusted (somewhat) to a preferred trigger pull. So, be careful watching "how to" videos .  .  .   there's a lot of blind leading the blind .
  For more adjustability for both springs in question, a thin washer under the spring will relocate the "home" position which will reduce the amount of "tuning" each spring may need. What you're looking for on the bolt side is no more than 3 lbs pressure measured on the bolt head. That reduces wear (dramatically) to the cam and bolt arm.  As stated before, the trigger spring can be adjusted as needed AFTER any adjustment to the main spring.

The biggest problem with flat and wire springs is that they both have limited working ranges and after that, they tend to "stack" (increase tension) quite rapidly. These days, I don't use flat springs and never liked wire springs! I change all action springs to coil/coil torsion springs. These springs have huge working ranges and for our use, they never leave the "sweet" spot and are highly adjustable. This in turn produces an extremely smooth and consistent force applied to the part it is acting on .  .  . not to mention, lifetime springs!!!

  So, problem or not, it is a very nice upgrade for all S.A. revolvers!  Heck, Ruger has been using them for half a century!!!

Mike
www.goonsgunworks.com
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Offline ssb73q

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Re: Is the trigger/bolt spring really a problem?
« Reply #5 on: June 14, 2018, 04:17:46 AM »
Hi Mike, I can understand doing "Ruger" type spring jobs on competition revolvers. However, while I have a number of times violated my philosophy of leaving 150yr old designed revolvers stock, I still like the idea of making smoke with the stock original designed revolver. My attempt on doing coil hand spring on my gated 1860 conversion ended with requiring grease on the arbor to prevent over rotation, yuck. Those coil hand spring mods I did addressed a non existent broken hand spring problem, I never broke a hand spring.

Other than slicking up the action and adding a poi=poa front sight, I like leaving my revolvers stock, but you already know that. I repeat it here for the benefit of other group members.

Regards,
Richard
There’s nothing better in the morning than the smell of bacon and black powder smoke!

Offline 45 Dragoon

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Re: Is the trigger/bolt spring really a problem?
« Reply #6 on: June 14, 2018, 08:06:38 AM »
I do understand your thoughts about a stock revolver but one has to remember, these copies from Italy are not really true copies (arbor problems, inferior springs, "mis-designed " action parts) and as such, exhibit problems that the originals didn't have.  The heat treating isn't up to snuff and most folks don't detect a wear problem until failure. The screws are too soft, the hands aren't hardened, the cams aren't a separate piece, the safety notch in the hammer is too wide which adds to the cap problem. So much difference between the copies and the originals is mainly why I try to "modernize" them to a point that makes them at least as reliable (possibly more so) as the originals.

  I can remember having to take my nasty Walker and Dragoons home early because of a mangled wedge or broken spring .  .  .  cutting short my shooting for the day. Cleaning "broken" guns is much less fun than than cleaning "excellent" guns!!
For me, putting a fine working, reliable cap gun in the hands of an avid shooter or competitor is the goal and for the shooter, he/ she gets to shoot the same revolver they shot last time, and will bring home the same revolver they left with .  .  . no broken parts, and a smile on their face!  I view the copies (especially today's copies) as a very nice platform in which to improve on the short comings and produce what hopefully would make Sam smile!! (Oh, and the Remies too!! Not to mention the ROAs!!)

Mike
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Offline Len

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Re: Is the trigger/bolt spring really a problem?
« Reply #7 on: June 14, 2018, 11:51:22 AM »
Just thinking out aloud, hoping for some comments:
Been shooting my original Colt Navy for some time now, after fattening the nipples up, to the degree that I have to really press the caps on, press hard with a wooden dowel. Can almost see the corrugated circumference flattening out (Nitro Nobel 1075:s). My basic idea was to try to find ways of keeping the caps from falling off the nipples from the ignition blow-back. Also tried with different loads (Triple 7). What I found to work best was 12 grains (please don't tell Johnnie). Haven't had a single cap suck since. As to the "stopping force", the 12 grains, from 15 yards onto a 1/4" iron sheet, totally fragments the balls (have a tarpaulin underneath).
Any savvy comments on the cap fitting force and the load are welcome.

Offline 45 Dragoon

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Re: Is the trigger/bolt spring really a problem?
« Reply #8 on: June 14, 2018, 02:12:46 PM »
Hmmmmm  .  .  .   I would think that the channel in the nipple may be a little bigger gauge than it started with ? That's assuming they are contemporary with the 1st gen Navy. I'm not even sure what fits original cyls.

Mike
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