photo Dragoon-Navyset_zps3txqpebh.jpg

Author Topic: There are gun lovers here in the City of Angels  (Read 3039 times)

Offline Ringo

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 180
    • View Profile
    • répliques Old West
Re: There are gun lovers here in the City of Angels
« Reply #15 on: January 18, 2016, 04:37:55 PM »
Thank you, Mo58.
This is my half fluted 1851, a Euroarms from 1974. Oddly enough the frame of most of these 1851 has turned reddish, whereas they originally were black.

I'd love to find a London 1851, but they are few and far between around these premises. Same goes for the Dances. :(

Offline mo58

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 26
  • Newbie
    • View Profile
Re: There are gun lovers here in the City of Angels
« Reply #16 on: January 18, 2016, 06:36:28 PM »
Quote
You have two rarities there : a 36 caliber Dance
just caught this ...The dance is .44.  Not sure if anyone made a 36 Dance repro. 

Offline Captainkirk

  • Administrator Extraordinaire and Part-Time Gunslinger
  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3564
  • "Nothing like a nice piece of hickory"
    • View Profile
Re: There are gun lovers here in the City of Angels
« Reply #17 on: January 18, 2016, 06:44:28 PM »
Thank you, Mo58.
This is my half fluted 1851, a Euroarms from 1974. Oddly enough the frame of most of these 1851 has turned reddish, whereas they originally were black.

I'd love to find a London 1851, but they are few and far between around these premises. Same goes for the Dances. :(
The reddish frames were (are) caused by high copper content in the steel. I have a Lyman '58 Remmy that is the same way. They gradually 'redden up' over time but did not leave the factory that color.
"You gonna pull those pistols, or whistle Dixie?"

Offline Fingers McGee

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 680
  • Show Me Shootout 2014 - TTN Hammer gun & BP
    • View Profile
    • Central Ozarks Western Shooters
Re: There are gun lovers here in the City of Angels
« Reply #18 on: January 18, 2016, 08:32:12 PM »
Quote
You have two rarities there : a 36 caliber Dance
just caught this ...The dance is .44.  Not sure if anyone made a 36 Dance repro.
Both Pietta and Uberti made a few of them in .36. Here is the thread that discusses them http://blackpowdersmoke.com/revolvers/index.php?topic=10.0
Fingers (Show Me MO smoke) McGee - AKA Man of Many Colts; SASS 28564-L-TG, rangemaster and stage writer extraordinaire; Frontiersman/Pistoleer, NRA Endowment Life, Central Ozarks Western Shooters
Cynic: A blackguard whose faulty vision sees things as they are, not as they should be.  Ambrose Bierce

Offline Ringo

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 180
    • View Profile
    • répliques Old West
Re: There are gun lovers here in the City of Angels
« Reply #19 on: January 19, 2016, 01:04:18 AM »
Quote
You have two rarities there : a 36 caliber Dance
just caught this ...The dance is .44.  Not sure if anyone made a 36 Dance repro.
My mistake, then. Sorry about that. The 36 Dance repros and originals are much scarcer than the 44, which are already hard to find. A 36 Dance replica is on top of my wishlist, but I guess it will have to stay there for a loooong time.

Offline Ringo

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 180
    • View Profile
    • répliques Old West
Re: There are gun lovers here in the City of Angels
« Reply #20 on: January 19, 2016, 01:12:19 AM »
The reddish frames were (are) caused by high copper content in the steel. I have a Lyman '58 Remmy that is the same way. They gradually 'redden up' over time but did not leave the factory that color.
I did not know there was any copper in steel. I thought it was the original blueing which had turned red due to whatever reason beyond me. I know the brass used by Confederate gunsmiths for the making of their revolvers frames may contain a high proportion of copper, thus showing a pinkish coloration, but I did not know that would occur to the steel used by Italian gunmakers too.  ???

Offline mo58

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 26
  • Newbie
    • View Profile
Re: There are gun lovers here in the City of Angels
« Reply #21 on: January 19, 2016, 01:58:49 AM »
Quote
The 36 Dance repros and originals are much scarcer than the 44, which are already hard to find. A 36 Dance replica is on top of my wishlist, but I guess it will have to stay there for a loooong time.
A fairly decent representation of a .36cal dance could easily be made. Theres enough meat on a 36 octagon barrel to round it out.
One could argue the legit representation of a 44cal Dance with an Octagon barrel also. Dance did produce some with a full octagon barrel ...and even a few with recoil shields. (be steal frame Griswold & Gunnison ...confusing! :P

If you're into these historically interesting revolvers I highly recommend checking out Gary Wiggins book: Dance & Brothers  Texas Gunmakers of the Confederacy

Quote
Both Pietta and Uberti made a few of them in .36. Here is the thread that discusses them http://blackpowdersmoke.com/revolvers/index.php?topic=10.0
Cool, thanks for the link.
Interesting that some repros were made with rebated cylinders. They used what they already made, hack the recoil shield and call it a Dance.  3 big differences that make my 44cal Dance a decent representation of an actual Dance: Lack of recoil shield, round barrel and a shorter, straight(non-rebated) cylinder.

Offline mo58

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 26
  • Newbie
    • View Profile
Re: There are gun lovers here in the City of Angels
« Reply #22 on: January 19, 2016, 02:24:16 AM »
Had to show off this specimen!  (7& Told my wife that it is my walking around the yard pistol.  :P
Needs some tightening up but the action is really good. I can tell the former owner shot this baby a bunch.
Pietta with a 'AS' date code. Dixie Gun Works, Inc stamped on top of barrel. Serial stamped on bottom of back strap.



Offline Ringo

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 180
    • View Profile
    • répliques Old West
Re: There are gun lovers here in the City of Angels
« Reply #23 on: January 19, 2016, 07:03:20 AM »
A fairly decent representation of a .36cal dance could easily be made. Theres enough meat on a 36 octagon barrel to round it out.
That's just what I did : round the octagon barrel of a 1851, and file the engraving from the cylinder.
This what it looked like before :

and what it looks like now :

I'm quite happy with it, but nothing could stop me from buying a "legit" replica if I found one.

If you're into these historically interesting revolvers I highly recommend checking out Gary Wiggins book: Dance & Brothers  Texas Gunmakers of the Confederacy
It is in my library. I found it quite interesting, but as Wiggins stresses out himself, there are still a whole lot of information missing about these revolvers.
I also have copies of two articles that were published in The Gun Report : "the Dance brothers Revolver - the Texas Dragoon" by Sam Maxwell in the november 1978 issue, and "two Texas pistol makers" by Roy E. Edwards in the november 1962 issue, as well as "Texas pistol makers of the Confederacy" and "Identification  and  Authentication of Confederate Handguns" by William A. Gary published in the bulletin of the American Society of Arms Collector and downloadable from http://americansocietyofarmscollectors.org/resources/articles/ , and "the Dance Brothers revolvers" published in the April 2012 issue of Heritage Arms Magazine. I also have Albaugh, Bennet and Simmons' "Confederate handguns" and "Texas Gun Lore" published in 1951 by Carroll C. Holloway.
All these sources, old and new, more or less repeat the same info, so there is still room for a definitive book about the Dance & Brothers revolvers. Same goes for most other Confederate revolvers : too few originals left, too little information source. Apart from some official letters and whatever remembrances could be mustered in the 1950s, next to nothing is left.  ???

Offline Captainkirk

  • Administrator Extraordinaire and Part-Time Gunslinger
  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3564
  • "Nothing like a nice piece of hickory"
    • View Profile
Re: There are gun lovers here in the City of Angels
« Reply #24 on: January 19, 2016, 07:34:09 AM »
I did not know there was any copper in steel. I thought it was the original blueing which had turned red due to whatever reason beyond me. I know the brass used by Confederate gunsmiths for the making of their revolvers frames may contain a high proportion of copper, thus showing a pinkish coloration, but I did not know that would occur to the steel used by Italian gunmakers too.  ???
Yes. Not sure where I read that (probably over on the Collector's Forum) but I had wondered about it too. Sounds like as good an answer as any. ;)
« Last Edit: January 20, 2016, 01:28:54 PM by Captainkirk »
"You gonna pull those pistols, or whistle Dixie?"

Offline G Dog

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 302
    • View Profile
Re: There are gun lovers here in the City of Angels
« Reply #25 on: January 19, 2016, 08:44:34 PM »
I have a Pietta 5.5 Remington made in 2011 that in the right light is beginning to show some of that  ‘purpling’.  A 6.5 Pietta Remington of the same year is not showing that nor is a 2000 eight inch Pietta.

Original Remington


Original Whitney






« Last Edit: January 19, 2016, 08:46:42 PM by G Dog »

Offline Captainkirk

  • Administrator Extraordinaire and Part-Time Gunslinger
  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3564
  • "Nothing like a nice piece of hickory"
    • View Profile
Re: There are gun lovers here in the City of Angels
« Reply #26 on: January 20, 2016, 03:49:05 AM »
G-
Is that 5.5 a .36?
"You gonna pull those pistols, or whistle Dixie?"

Offline mo58

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 26
  • Newbie
    • View Profile
Re: There are gun lovers here in the City of Angels
« Reply #27 on: January 20, 2016, 01:12:28 PM »
 ;D I could just hang out and ponder all thats going on here on my welcome wagon thread. 

Quote
That's just what I did : round the octagon barrel of a 1851, and file the engraving from the cylinder.
ha! well there ya go! Italians would have done the same darn thing... so just as legit  ;)

Quote
I have a Pietta 5.5 Remington made in 2011 that in the right light is beginning to show some of that  ‘purpling’.
Wow thats a plum colored pistol!
Weathering steel (COR-TEN) comes to mind. Alloy mix that includes copper to allow a stable reddish rust.
G Dog..
That Spiller & Burr... the recoil shield capping cut-out (lacking proper term) ...is that original or has it been modified? Its a full size cut compared to the smaller rounded v cuts in my spillers. 
« Last Edit: January 20, 2016, 01:15:30 PM by mo58 »

Offline Captainkirk

  • Administrator Extraordinaire and Part-Time Gunslinger
  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3564
  • "Nothing like a nice piece of hickory"
    • View Profile
Re: There are gun lovers here in the City of Angels
« Reply #28 on: January 20, 2016, 01:30:50 PM »
;D I could just hang out and ponder all thats going on here on my welcome wagon thread.   

You could! But just look at what you started! L@J
I'd say that's a sight better than ignoring you..... ;)
"You gonna pull those pistols, or whistle Dixie?"

Offline Ringo

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 180
    • View Profile
    • répliques Old West
Re: There are gun lovers here in the City of Angels
« Reply #29 on: January 20, 2016, 02:12:10 PM »
Quote
That's just what I did : round the octagon barrel of a 1851, and file the engraving from the cylinder.
ha! well there ya go! Italians would have done the same darn thing... so just as legit  ;)
Maybe you're right after all... Maybe I did what was best.
After all, as the Duke said "a man's gotta do what a man's gotta do"...  ;)