Author Topic: Remington question  (Read 9352 times)

Offline Rock Island

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Remington question
« on: July 12, 2010, 10:17:59 AM »
Does anyone know who was making the 1858 Remington New Army revolver for Lyman in 1972?  I have a chance to pick one up, and I know it's either Armi San Palo, or Uberti.  Cylinder has a slight drag mark, something is out of adjustment, but I have spare new Uberti clyinders for the Rem.  I am also considering a Pietta, I have one already but would like two.
If it shoots then I have it, am about to get it, want it, or plotting to get it

Offline Smokey

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Re: Remington question
« Reply #1 on: July 12, 2010, 10:58:59 AM »
Uberti made the Remingtons, ASP made the Colts. Uberti quality at reasonable prices. My plain seel one is 1972 the blued one 1971. I would love to find more.
If you can get it reasonable, I'd be all over it like stink on that smelly stuff.
« Last Edit: July 12, 2010, 11:18:25 AM by Smokey »
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Offline drjldavis

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Re: Remington question
« Reply #2 on: July 14, 2010, 03:11:30 PM »
Lyman marketed four different models of replica revolver.  The 1851 Navy, 1860 Army, and the Remington Beals  which were made by Armi San Paolo.  Their Remington New Model Army was made by Uberti.

Offline drjldavis

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Re: Remington question
« Reply #3 on: July 30, 2010, 01:25:31 PM »
Lyman's black powder revolvers were made by Armi San Paolo and Uberti.
Following are models that have been observed. If anyone knows of any others I would like to add them to the list.

Armi San Paolo (Now Euroarms)

1851 Navy
1851 Navy Civilian Model
1860 Army Civilian Model
Remington Beals Army
Remington Beals Navy

Uberti

Remington 1858 New Model Army
Remington 1858 New Model Navy

Offline Rock Island

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Re: Remington question
« Reply #4 on: July 30, 2010, 08:22:29 PM »
Thank you for the information, I was looking at a Lyman Remington 1858, but someone got to it first, I be better armed with this information the next time one comes along.
If it shoots then I have it, am about to get it, want it, or plotting to get it

Offline Smokey

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Re: Remington question
« Reply #5 on: August 01, 2010, 10:38:04 AM »
Dr. Davis, thanks for the clarification on the Remingtons. I have the 1861 New Armies, I would have assumed the Beals would also be made by Uberti.
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Offline drjldavis

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Re: Remington question
« Reply #6 on: August 01, 2010, 11:51:48 AM »
Smokey,

I looked through our database to see if there was a Remington Beals made by Uberti.  We have 30 Remington Beals in our collection but none by Uberti.  The Remington Beals that were produced are, of course, not 100% accurate as are most replicas.  The one we identify as Remington Beals are identified by the smaller size frame and the covered barrel threads in front of the cylinder.  I have examined original Remington Beals (advantage of living in the same town as the J. M. Davis Gun Museum) and have found that the frame comes back all the way to the front of the cylinder, frame being parallel to the front of the cylinder.  On the replicas there is a slight arc in the frame, but the threads are almost completely covered.  I have seen pictures of original Beals that also have this arc.

It is interesting to note that in the beginning of the Replica Industry when everybody was trying to get into the act, original model revolvers were sent to the various manufacturers with the instructions to copy this model.  Since a lot of the companies requesting this, the people putting it together were not sometimes “informed” about the differences in original guns.  The Remington Beals was one of the revolvers provided but with the nomenclature that it was a Remington New Model Army.  The replicas were consequentially marketed as Remington New Model Army. 

If you check through all issues of Blue Book in the manufacturers you will not find a single Remington Beals listed as a separate model.  They are all lumped together as Remington New Model Army.  It was this discovery over 16yrs ago that first got me interested in collecting the replicas.  I had purchased my first percussion revolver made by Lyman at a gun show.  I then ordered another one from Cabela’s, a Pietta, to make a two gun set.  When it arrived I was fondling them, as us “adult children” do, and immediately discovered that the two revolvers were not the same size.   After a little research I discovered the “Remington Beals”.  Thus the curiosity grew into a collection of over 900 revolvers.

I will list the manufacturers we have discovered of the Remington Beals replica on a future posting.

Offline Smokin_Gun

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Re: Remington question
« Reply #7 on: September 04, 2010, 02:37:33 AM »
I have a Remington 1861 old Army .44

1861 Old Army Rem and original ASP  

My 1858 Rem NMA ASP is closest to the size and features only 2nd to the E.N. Santa Barbara1858 Rem NMA .44
ASP

E.N. Santa Barabara


1858 NMN .36 cal Rem Euroarms
I compared them to my 1861 .44 and a 1858 NMA .44 at a gunshop.... The Uberti would be next most accurate to size and features then the Pietta which is larger than the Uberti also.
1858 ASP, Rem 1861 Old Army, 1858 Uberti Comparison pics



None of the replicas have a Beals upright hammer, flat frame in front of the cylinder, or the Beals loading lever with the tiny web and rounded lever ... and the differance can be felt with the ASPs and Euroarms but none I've seen look the the Beals posted below.



I had talked with Halfway Creek Charlie on this matter at my house and at the Range when we tested his Pietta .44Colt Conversion 1858 NMA...my ASP is a NMA .44 along with my Euroarms 1858 New Model Navy .36 are 1858s made in 1863 not Beals reproductions. That was about 3-4 years ago I researched this and I found no Beals reproductions...Charlie started that rumor I believe on CAS Forum before we compared them ... the ASP/Euroarms was his favored 1858 NMA also ... he was lookin' for a Euroarms or ASP 1851 navy at that time.
If wrong I'll stand corrected but I dug deep lookin' for a Beals replica and you have jus' read my results.
That cowboy left with the wind haven't heard from him since then.

« Last Edit: September 06, 2010, 01:14:15 PM by Smokin_Gun »
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Offline Hoof Hearted

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Re: Remington question
« Reply #8 on: February 03, 2011, 08:04:50 PM »
I build a "close" replica of the Beals Army model out of the Euroarms replica. I have done a number of them and have three in the shop right now to do.
I am still shopping the sight around trying to get a decent copy made by a jeweler for a reasonable price and other than that the only issue it the frame cutout in front of the "wings" on the cylinder pin.
I posted a pic or two in the conversion forum.

By the way the pistol above is a Navy and they are quite different looking when compared to an Army............

On the OP subject of Lyman Army replicas:
I like the Lyman because it has the grip scre and Escutcheons in the correct place and the threaded escutcheon has the "wings" like an original Remington. They dress up nice!
Check out my new website:

http://www.cartridgeconversion.com

Offline Rock Island

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Re: Remington question
« Reply #9 on: February 04, 2011, 07:35:42 AM »
I ended up outbid on the Lyman and eventually bought three more Piettas to go with my two Uberti Millennium revolvers, two blued and one stainless steel, then I had to have a set of Ruger Old Armys.
If it shoots then I have it, am about to get it, want it, or plotting to get it