Author Topic: Collecting .31cal. Replica Revolvers  (Read 21269 times)

Offline drjldavis

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Collecting .31cal. Replica Revolvers
« on: July 25, 2010, 12:59:09 PM »
Collecting the Replica .31cal. Revolvers

The .31cal. revolvers are an interesting group of replica revolvers that offer enough variations to be collectable by themselves.  Listed are a number of variations that have been uncovered.  It is interesting to note that in the original Colt .31cal. revolvers, that two different size frames were produced.  (See “Did You Know” section of this Forum)

1848 Baby Dragoon .31cal. Five Shot (Square Back Trigger Guard)
 
       1.   1848 Baby Dragoon Short Frame(SF) with LL - Brass SqBk TG & BkS
       2.   1848 Baby Dragoon Short Frame(SF) with LL - Silver SqBk TG & BkS
       3.   1848 Baby Dragoon Short Frame(SF) with LL - Brass SqBk TG & BkS - Barrel
                   Wedge from Right
       4.   1848 Baby Dragoon Short Frame(SF) without LL - Brass SqBk TG & BkS
       5.   1848 Baby Dragoon Short Frame(SF) without LL - Silver SqBk TG & BkS
       6.   1848 Baby Dragoon Long Frame(LF) In White without LL -
                    Brass SqBk TG & BkS - Oval Cylinder Stops
       7.   1848 Baby Dragoon Long Frame(LF) with LL - Brass SqBk TG & BkS -
                    Oval Cylinder Stops
       8.   1848 Baby Dragoon Long Frame(LF) with LL - Silver SqBk TG & BkS –
                    Oval Cylinder Stops

1849 Pocket Model .31cal. Five Shot (Oval Trigger Guard)
      
       1.   1849 Pocket Model Short Frame(SF) - Brass TG & BkS
       2.   1849 Pocket Model Short Frame(SF) - Silver TG & BkS
       3.   1849 Pocket Model Short Frame(SF) - Brass BkS & TG - Dragoon Barrel
       4.   1849 Pocket Model Long Frame(LF) - Brass TG & BkS
       5.   1849 Pocket Model Long Frame(LF) - Silver TG & BkS

1849 Wells Fargo Model .31cal. Five Shot (Oval Trigger Guard)

      1.   1849 Wells Fargo Short Frame(SF) - Brass BkS & TG
      2.   1849 Wells Fargo Short Frame(SF) - Silver BkS &
      3.   1849 Wells Fargo Long Frame(LF) - Brass BkS & TG
      4.   1849 Wells Fargo Long Frame(LF) – Brass BkS & TG
      5.   1849 Wells Fargo Long Frame(LF) - Silver BkS & TG)

1855 Roots Side Hammer
      
       1.   1855 Roots Side hammer .31cal. - 3 ½” barrel
       2.   1855 Roots Side hammer .31cal. - 5 ½” barrel
      
Baby Dragoon Revolvers .31cal. - Brass Frame
      
       1.   1848 Baby Dragoon Brass .31cal. with loading lever - 4” Barrel
       2.   1848 Baby Dragoon Brass .31cal. with loading lever - 4” Barrel - Engraved
       3.   1848 Baby Dragoon Brass .31cal. with loading lever - 6” Barrel
       4.   1848 Baby Dragoon Brass .31cal. with loading lever - 6” Barrel - Engraved
       5.   1849 Wells Fargo Brass .31cal. - 4” Barrel
      
Remington New Model Pocket
      
       1.   1863 New Model Pocket Brass
       2.   1863 New Model Pocket Steel
       3.   1863 New Model Pocket Nickel

« Last Edit: July 25, 2010, 10:26:57 PM by drjldavis »

Offline Smokey

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Re: Collecting .31cal. Replica Revolvers
« Reply #1 on: July 25, 2010, 02:19:05 PM »
drjldavis , that is some fantastic information. I have been considering a 31 cal, that saved me a lot of research. Thank you.
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Offline Rock Island

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Re: Collecting .31cal. Replica Revolvers
« Reply #2 on: July 25, 2010, 07:39:32 PM »
I have been looking into a steel frame .31 Remington, great information, thatnk you for posting it  8) 8) 8)
If it shoots then I have it, am about to get it, want it, or plotting to get it

Offline StrawHat

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Re: Collecting .31cal. Replica Revolvers
« Reply #3 on: July 25, 2010, 09:22:14 PM »
You list the Wells Fargo, Baby Dragoon and the Pocket Model as all having 6 shot cylinders.  I have a steel frame 31 caliber copy of the Colts revolver with a 5 shot cylinder.  6" barrel with brass backstrap and triggerguard.  What is it?  I always thought it was a Baby Dragoon.  Thanks for your help?
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Offline drjldavis

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Re: Collecting .31cal. Replica Revolvers
« Reply #4 on: July 25, 2010, 10:35:34 PM »
Thank you StrawHat,

The Replica Baby Dragoons and Pocket Models are five shot not six shot.  Colt produced the 1849 Pocket Model in both five shot and six shot but I am not aware of any replicas with six shot cylinder.  This was an oversight on my part in editing.  This information is taken from part of the book that I have been researching for over 16yrs and I do my own editing up to this point, confuse information and do make mistakes.  I'll try do be more correct in the future.

In the replicas the only difference between the Baby Dragoon and the Pocket Models is that the Baby Dragoons have a square back trigger guard.  The Pocket Model with oval trigger guard without the loading lever it is the Wells Fargo Model.
« Last Edit: July 26, 2010, 11:31:06 AM by drjldavis »

Offline StrawHat

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Re: Collecting .31cal. Replica Revolvers
« Reply #5 on: July 27, 2010, 05:11:28 AM »
Thank you StrawHat,

The Replica Baby Dragoons and Pocket Models are five shot not six shot.  Colt produced the 1849 Pocket Model in both five shot and six shot but I am not aware of any replicas with six shot cylinder.  This was an oversight on my part in editing.  This information is taken from part of the book that I have been researching for over 16yrs and I do my own editing up to this point, confuse information and do make mistakes.  I'll try do be more correct in the future.

In the replicas the only difference between the Baby Dragoon and the Pocket Models is that the Baby Dragoons have a square back trigger guard.  The Pocket Model with oval trigger guard without the loading lever it is the Wells Fargo Model.

I understand the editing oversight.  I was researching Baker shotguns for about 15 years with the intent on publishing.  So much info, so little memory!

So this would be a Baby Dragoon, thank you.







The date stamp indicates 1871 ([correction 28 July], how about 1971, probably closer)  but I can find no makers mark on the little revolver.  The Ranger fight scene is strong but some of the polishing is weak.  A neat little revolver but I prefer the 36 caliber.  Maybe if I get this out to the range my opinion will change.  It appears unfired so I am reluctant to take it out.  
« Last Edit: July 28, 2010, 05:58:19 AM by StrawHat »
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Offline drjldavis

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Re: Collecting .31cal. Replica Revolvers
« Reply #6 on: July 27, 2010, 11:33:42 AM »
This is a Baby Dragoon with Loading Lever.  I cannot read the date code after XX.  Most of the revolvers that are simply marked "Made in Italy" are Armi San Marco or a sub contractor.  Since ASM was the only manufacturer producing the Walker, Dragoons, Baby Dragoons, and Pocket Models in the 1960’s it is fairly safe to assume that they were the manufacturer or one of the subs.

We find the MOFRA and Double Diamond markings on early Paterson revolvers.  That is one reason these two markings may be connected to Pietta since they were the only company making the Paterson in the 1960’s that we know of.  Uberti did not start producing the Paterson until the 1990’s.  If anyone has a Uberti Paterson with a date code earlier than the 1990’s please let us know.  Uberti was purchased by Beretta and has no records available.

Offline Smokin_Gun

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Re: Collecting .31cal. Replica Revolvers
« Reply #7 on: August 05, 2010, 05:03:27 AM »
That's quite a list of pocket .31's there Drdavis... One thing i like about the 5 shot's vs the 6 six shot revs is that the bolt locks the cylinder up in the slot wth the hammer directly between two cylinders. And you have a fully loaded revolver that can be safely carried. Along with the diameter of the cylinder being smaller to carry.
I've only one Pocket and it's a Factory Colt cartridge pocket 38Colt. But after your listings I may have need of another .31 Pocket Baby Dragoon.
Good Post.

Strawhat good lookin' Pocket gun...
« Last Edit: August 05, 2010, 05:05:28 AM by Smokin_Gun »
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Offline Fingers McGee

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Re: Collecting .31cal. Replica Revolvers
« Reply #8 on: August 05, 2010, 02:10:28 PM »
One thing i like about the 5 shot's vs the 6 six shot revs is that the bolt locks the cylinder up in the slot wth the hammer directly between two cylinders. And you have a fully loaded revolver that can be safely carried.

SG.  The bolt always locks with a chamber in line with the barrel; whether it be a 5 shot or 6 shot cylinder.   

AAMOF, 5 and 6 shot cylinders on the '49 pocket models are pretty much interchangeable. And, R&D 6 shot .32 S&W conversion cylinders are pretty much a drop in fit on Uberti '49 Pocket models.  I say pretty much; because som minor fitting might be necessary.  The R&D I got for my Uberti '49 Pocket dropped in and worked perfectly out of the box.  Only sticking point was getting the wedge adjusted properly for proper headspace.

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Offline Smokin_Gun

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Re: Collecting .31cal. Replica Revolvers
« Reply #9 on: August 22, 2010, 01:43:06 AM »
That's right Fingers my bad self... My Pocket Police .38Colt loaded cylinder stays in place with the hammer down between two case heads on the original Colt. My Pietta/kirst won't do that do to the single transfer ball/bar type firing pin on the cyl. plate/ring no hammer between the case heads. The Colt Pocket hammer goes thru the plate/ring to the cylinder.
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Offline StrawHat

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Re: Collecting .31cal. Replica Revolvers
« Reply #10 on: November 11, 2010, 06:38:09 AM »
One question about Baby Dragoons.  Do they all have a small trigger guard?  I can barley get my finger in there!  My Pocket Navies and Pocket Police all have plenty of room but the Baby Dragoon, not so much.  Anyone else notice this?

Thanks.
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Offline Smokin_Gun

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Re: Collecting .31cal. Replica Revolvers
« Reply #11 on: December 13, 2010, 01:32:42 AM »
StrawHat, I've only owned one of them Baby Dragoons and it was an ASM and it had as much T.G. room as my Pocket Police or more with the Square back Trigger Guard that mine had on it. What make is yours?
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Offline Smokin_Gun

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Offline StrawHat

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Re: Collecting .31cal. Replica Revolvers
« Reply #13 on: December 22, 2010, 07:00:02 AM »
StrawHat, I've only owned one of them Baby Dragoons and it was an ASM and it had as much T.G. room as my Pocket Police or more with the Square back Trigger Guard that mine had on it. What make is yours?...

Here's some pics of the Colt Baby Dragoon .31 cal... I'm guessin' you have the Oval trigger guard on yours...

There are no makers marks on the revolver so for now it is unknown.  The trigger guard is squared off.  Photos are posted above in the thread.
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Offline Smokin_Gun

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Re: Collecting .31cal. Replica Revolvers
« Reply #14 on: December 23, 2010, 12:44:27 AM »
StrawHat could it have maybe been a kit? Sometimes there's a Mfg. Stamp on the frame under the grips of the gripframe. Are you keepin' this one? Just bein' nosey  :)
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