The Black Powder Revolver Collecting Forum

Percussion Revolvers => Remingtons => Army (NMA) Models => Topic started by: tljack on March 10, 2018, 08:29:15 PM

Title: Reading with interest comments from Dec 2016
Post by: tljack on March 10, 2018, 08:29:15 PM
The discussion I was reading started with comments on the "1858 New Army Brass 44 cal. revolver Cabala's was advertising. I realize this is old topic but it caught my eye. Since the participation level on this forum is not exactly busy I thought I'd chime in.

 I did not see the ad but is it possible the gun they were selling was a copy of a Spiller and Burr? You no doubt know it was a brass frame Confederate gun.

Recently I obtained Dennis Adler's book "Guns of the Civil War". I imagine it is not absolutely complete, it is very thorough.  No where in this book does he mention any actual Confederate copy of a Remington. He does cover the S&B however.

Any thoughts?

Tljack
Title: Re: Reading with interest comments from Dec 2016
Post by: Captainkirk on March 11, 2018, 10:00:41 PM
I've found no evidence...none...that there was ever any Confederate copy of the Remington...brass or otherwise...ever produced. Closest thing to it would be the S&B...which we all know was a brass clone of Whitney.
While they certainly went out of their way to copy a bunch of Colts and Colt derivatives and others both in brass and steel, why they would ignore the Remmy is a complete mystery to me.
Title: Re: Reading with interest comments from Dec 2016
Post by: tljack on March 12, 2018, 11:38:58 AM
I've found no evidence...none...that there was ever any Confederate copy of the Remington...brass or otherwise...ever produced. Closest thing to it would be the S&B...which we all know was a brass clone of Whitney.
While they certainly went out of their way to copy a bunch of Colts and Colt derivatives and others both in brass and steel, why they would ignore the Remmy is a complete mystery to me.

I often wonder why they have not made copies of several nice "real" revolvers. Instead, they fool around with fantasy guns.

Terry
Title: Re: Reading with interest comments from Dec 2016
Post by: sourdough on March 12, 2018, 02:17:31 PM
I've found no evidence...none...that there was ever any Confederate copy of the Remington...brass or otherwise...ever produced. Closest thing to it would be the S&B...which we all know was a brass clone of Whitney.
While they certainly went out of their way to copy a bunch of Colts and Colt derivatives and others both in brass and steel, why they would ignore the Remmy is a complete mystery to me.

Cap'n, you are very correct, especially as concerns a brasser. This is a fantasy pistol at best.

Since I have been into BP C&B revolvers, it has always irked me that the Remington New Model Army has had the misnomer "1858" attached to the name when it comes to repro pistols. The "1858" refers to the patent date (I believe it was Remington-Beals) insofar as the solid frame. The Remington NMA/NMN was never produced prior to 1863. Since the 1851 Navy .36 was produced by Colt starting in late 1850, the Confederate gun makers [Schneider & Glassick, Griswold & Gunnison, Augusta Machine Works, and Columbus Firearms Company (L. Haiman and Brother), as well as some Dance Brothers and Tucker & Sherrard in Texas] had ample 1851 Navies available to copy since Colt had produced tens of thousands of them by the beginning of the ACW.

The Remington was late to the game insofar as Confederate arms manufacturers, and the NMA was a .44 caliber pistol. I believe the Confederates saw the .36 as desirable because it used less lead and BP than a .44, and both were in somewhat short supply as the ACW wore on.

The 1851 Navy .36 was tried and true, and it was the sidearm of Robert E. Lee. He even surrendered it to Grant at Appomattox Court House, but Grant told him to keep it and just go home.

Just my $.02 worth.

Jim
Title: Re: Reading with interest comments from Dec 2016
Post by: Captainkirk on March 12, 2018, 02:59:33 PM
Jim, you are correct regarding the (1858) Beals. Remington purchased the patent and the first NMA Remingtons rolled out in late 1862/early 1863 near the end of the ACW. However, the original Remington pocket revolvers were indeed brass-framed. In fact, 3 versions of the Remington Pocket were issued; brass w/ brass TG, steel w/brass TG and finally steel w/ steel TG. According to Mike Beliveau, the original steel frame/brass TG are the rarest of the pockets...